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johnpalmerI hate arguments about having a government issued photo ID for voting. But what I really hate is lame-brain stupidity in the making of those argument.
You have to show ID to buy alcohol, don't you?
No. No, a seller can get in deep trouble if shown to have sold alcohol to someone underage, or even if they show that they don't take the responsibility seriously. But you do not have to show ID, not if there's a way to establish your age other than the ID.
Even if you did, there's a huge difference between buying alcohol and voting.
When you want to buy alcohol, it is not yet your alcohol, and no one is typically forced to sell to you. When you want to vote, it's already your vote, your voice, your power - and demanding ID is simply a method of trying to take it away from you.
But more importantly, this nation was founded on the principle that the government exists to serve the people, and that the people grant the power of governance. To say "you only have that power if you jump through governmental hoops" is to reverse that - to say that we exist to serve the government... that first we have to serve the government, and then, if they're in the mood, only then will they serve us.
On election day, the government should at least pretend that they care about us, and about our voice, and should at least give a symbolic bow to our sovereignty. Instead, there are many people who want to deny us our voice, because they want us silenced.
Oh, they claim to be afraid of widespread voter fraud, but the fact of the matter is, there's barely any going on. But there doesn't need to be any, does there? You just need people to talk about it, and people assume there must be an issue. After all, people don't talk, and talk, and talk, about a meaningless issue right?
For example, there was lots of talk about how Iraq was full to bursting with Weapons of Mass Destruction and... wow, did that turn out to be a bust!
It's crazy, because probably 85, 90, maybe even 95% of people won't have any problems dealing with a picture ID requirement, so they won't see what the big fuss is.
The problem is this: the people who live out on the border, the kinds of people who have a hard time getting a government issued picture ID, are typically the people who have nothing else. They have no say in our government, except that one day when they're supposed to - the day they're allowed to speak up and say who should be in charge.
Taking the one thing they have, the one bit of voice, the one bit of power they have, is the worst form of bullying.
Voter fraud is not a problem; demanding government issued ID to combat it is causing much more harm than any possible good that could come from it.
You have to show ID to buy alcohol, don't you?
No. No, a seller can get in deep trouble if shown to have sold alcohol to someone underage, or even if they show that they don't take the responsibility seriously. But you do not have to show ID, not if there's a way to establish your age other than the ID.
Even if you did, there's a huge difference between buying alcohol and voting.
When you want to buy alcohol, it is not yet your alcohol, and no one is typically forced to sell to you. When you want to vote, it's already your vote, your voice, your power - and demanding ID is simply a method of trying to take it away from you.
But more importantly, this nation was founded on the principle that the government exists to serve the people, and that the people grant the power of governance. To say "you only have that power if you jump through governmental hoops" is to reverse that - to say that we exist to serve the government... that first we have to serve the government, and then, if they're in the mood, only then will they serve us.
On election day, the government should at least pretend that they care about us, and about our voice, and should at least give a symbolic bow to our sovereignty. Instead, there are many people who want to deny us our voice, because they want us silenced.
Oh, they claim to be afraid of widespread voter fraud, but the fact of the matter is, there's barely any going on. But there doesn't need to be any, does there? You just need people to talk about it, and people assume there must be an issue. After all, people don't talk, and talk, and talk, about a meaningless issue right?
For example, there was lots of talk about how Iraq was full to bursting with Weapons of Mass Destruction and... wow, did that turn out to be a bust!
It's crazy, because probably 85, 90, maybe even 95% of people won't have any problems dealing with a picture ID requirement, so they won't see what the big fuss is.
The problem is this: the people who live out on the border, the kinds of people who have a hard time getting a government issued picture ID, are typically the people who have nothing else. They have no say in our government, except that one day when they're supposed to - the day they're allowed to speak up and say who should be in charge.
Taking the one thing they have, the one bit of voice, the one bit of power they have, is the worst form of bullying.
Voter fraud is not a problem; demanding government issued ID to combat it is causing much more harm than any possible good that could come from it.
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no subject
Date: 2011-12-13 09:28 pm (UTC)either
Date: 2011-12-13 10:18 pm (UTC)I seem to remember a fairytale or two where peoples personality ( and identity ) was revealed by letting them judge others or plan preventive measures. Of course if we apply the rule to the anti-gay crowd that will not allow gay-marriage because next thing 'they' will want to marry their dogs, horses, sheep, cars ...., then we get an interesting result. ( grin)
also
Date: 2011-12-14 12:24 am (UTC)Now that is about control: if you know where the rabble lives you can control it.
A detail : once carrying an ID is obligatory it becomes so much easier for law-enforcement to keep someone for a day or so "just until we have determined hir ID "
I speak fro Europe where ID cards are common , I know the police here can check my Id even if I do not carry my ID ( a short query in the central database ) - however if someone pisses them off they can hold you 'till the end of the next day' for establishing your ID.
( I once knew someone who answered a snappy "None of your business" when asked at 3am where he was walking. ) Given percieved reality, I would not be surprised if sometimes PoC were stopped more often and held more often for ID.